Where are the female anti-heroes?
Jun. 25th, 2012 08:15 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
next_to_normalI was listening to the Firewall & Iceberg Podcast today, and one of the topics they addressed was the fan reaction to the wives of anti-hero characters. Think Betty Draper, Skyler White, or Carmella Soprano - in any other context, they'd be the sympathetic partner, even considered a victim, but because their husbands (despicable as they may be) are the show's main characters, the women tend to get a lot of hate for (a) inadvertently complicating the husbands' secret lives, (b) trying to find out their secrets, and/or (c) daring to call them on their shit. As if wanting to know what your husband is hiding from you is an unreasonable expectation. As if being appalled is an inappropriate response to the revelation that he is a murderer/drug dealer/mob boss/cheater/scumbag/whatever.
Okay, preaching to the choir here, I know. Anyway, the comment that prompted this post was wondering whether the reaction would be the same if it were a female character who was the anti-hero, and her husband/partner was the one standing in the way of her criminal enterprise, or if their respective genders matter. Now, the podcast is made by dudes, so I'll forgive them for not knowing the obvious answer (yes, of course gender matters) and skip right to what I think is most interesting:
This is entirely a hypothetical question, because as far as I can tell, there are no female anti-heroes like that, much less ones with a hated spouse/partner to use as a comparison.
Seriously - can anyone think of one?Because I'd probably really like that story. The closest I can come up with is Veronica Mars, who's a ruthless and occasionally cruel person who has no qualms about breaking the law to get what she wants. The parallel is strongest in season 3 - before that, she's still the plucky, albeit flawed, heroine, whereas in season 3 she becomes flat-out unlikable at times. But even then, I don't think she ever reaches the level of a Don Draper or a Walter White.
Similarly, characters like Katniss or Buffy or Elena, although they may go through unlikable phases, never lose their "heroine" sheen. They're just good people going through remarkably difficult situations. And frequently THEY are the ones who get the fan hate, not their put-upon male partners, which goes back to the thing about gender influencing fan reactions.
I suppose that answers my own question about why there aren't more female characters that could be considered anti-heroes, doesn't it? If fans will react so negatively to flawed female heroines, God only knows how badly they'd eviscerate a female Don Draper. But y'all know how I love me some flawed characters, especially ladies, so if you can think of any - or have any other thoughts on the subject - please chime in!
Okay, preaching to the choir here, I know. Anyway, the comment that prompted this post was wondering whether the reaction would be the same if it were a female character who was the anti-hero, and her husband/partner was the one standing in the way of her criminal enterprise, or if their respective genders matter. Now, the podcast is made by dudes, so I'll forgive them for not knowing the obvious answer (yes, of course gender matters) and skip right to what I think is most interesting:
This is entirely a hypothetical question, because as far as I can tell, there are no female anti-heroes like that, much less ones with a hated spouse/partner to use as a comparison.
Seriously - can anyone think of one?
Similarly, characters like Katniss or Buffy or Elena, although they may go through unlikable phases, never lose their "heroine" sheen. They're just good people going through remarkably difficult situations. And frequently THEY are the ones who get the fan hate, not their put-upon male partners, which goes back to the thing about gender influencing fan reactions.
I suppose that answers my own question about why there aren't more female characters that could be considered anti-heroes, doesn't it? If fans will react so negatively to flawed female heroines, God only knows how badly they'd eviscerate a female Don Draper. But y'all know how I love me some flawed characters, especially ladies, so if you can think of any - or have any other thoughts on the subject - please chime in!
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Date: Jun. 26th, 2012 10:44 pm (UTC)with the exception of Buffy, I suppose
Buffy did have Xander and Angel in S1, who were fairly slashable, and then Spike and Angel from S2 onwards. I've actually been wondering what the early Buffy fandom was like - what were the first pairings? Because Buffyverse is an interesting fandom in that it's neither het nor slash dominated, but both sides of the fandom seem equally strong (and femslash is also pretty popular, which is even more rare).
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Date: Jun. 26th, 2012 11:10 pm (UTC)Buffyverse is an odd fandom. I wasn't around in the beginning, but I would guess the het pairings were dominant then (specifically Buffy/Angel, Buffy/Xander, and Willow/Xander), with the slash pairings really gaining traction once Spike showed up. Or who knows? Maybe we missed out on some epic Xander/Jesse slash. :-P
The femslash doesn't surprise me, though - there are just so many female characters in the ensemble to choose from, some of whom are even canonically lesbians! You rarely get that kind of material to work with.