Comics wank, must be... a day ending in y

[next_to_normal]

So, angearia, who has once again been a VERY BAD GIRL over at Whedonesque, linked to this thread about the Dark Horse "announcement" that they are maybe acquiring the rights to the Angel series or something. As usual, there is wild speculation about it, all of which is pretty ridiculous, given that we have zero details about what it means or even what actually is happening. All I can really do is roll my eyes at the fact that Dark Horse STILL has not done anything about the unmitigated incompetence that is their PR department.

However, the comments on that thread brought up something I thought was interesting. God only knows what it has to do with licensing, but there was discussion about whether or not Season 8 should have included some backstory about Connor and the other Angel characters.

Some people said that such a conversation has no place in S8, since most of the Buffy characters don't even know who Angel's people are anymore, and there wasn't really an opportune time for Angel to explain to Buffy exactly how he acquired a son, nor would it be in his best interest to do so, if he wants Buffy to trust him. Not to mention the fact that there likely would be a licensing issue preventing them from mentioning any Angel character who did not originate on Buffy, so there's a good possibility they couldn't mention Connor even if they wanted to.

Others argued that, without that information, it is impossible to understand Angel's character, since in Angel we were led to believe that Connor was the most important person in the world to Angel, and it's hard to believe that he would willingly destroy a world that has his friends and especially his son still in it.

I agree with both of those things.

Setting aside the fact that S8 isn't over, and we could yet get such an explanation, I think this illustrates exactly why Angel as Twilight was a bad storytelling decision. Much like Willow's appearance in Angel S4 and Angel's appearance in Buffy S7, there really isn't space to fill in everything that's been happening to the character in the other series. But that doesn't negate the fact that these characters do have entire lives going on elsewhere, and those things affect them. A good writer doesn't just ignore character development because it doesn't fit into the story he wants to tell.

IMO, if they can't figure out how to portray a crossover character in a way that is both in character and does not require elaborate backstory explanations that bog down the story, then they shouldn't use that character. Period. Come up with a different story that's more workable.

Incidentally, I think the crossovers worked a lot better early on, before too many changes put the two series on increasingly divergent paths. It was easier to provide exposition when the characters mostly knew each other and not much had happened since they'd last seen each other. Once both series brought in new characters and major plot developments, the necessary exposition becomes far too unwieldy, so the choice is either abandon the idea of crossovers or ignore important developments because you can't explain them properly - or stick to characters (like Faith) whose backstory doesn't require a lot of explanation.

Comments

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

I agree with both of those things.

Yeah. Pretty much. It would take more time and space than Season 8 can allow/afford to explain all of that. On the other hand Angel is incomprehensible without it. Catch-22. Plus there's the part where revealing all of that would also reveal how very little Buffy knows of Angel any more which would be a downer given their great 'epic' universe-fated 'wuv' that's worth the destruction of lives and worlds. [insert non-existent eyerolling icon here]

[rahirah]

Honestly, I think that S8 would have been infinitely better if we'd known who Twilight was early on. The suspense would have been in characters like Giles trying to find out if there was any way to prevent the prophecy, and Buffy torn between her own mission with the Slayers and the desire for the paradise Twangel promised. While on the other side we could have had Angel convinced he was doing the right thing, and trying to minimize losses as he played all these factions against one another. That could have been awesome.

Perhaps licensing concerns would have prevented that, but I find it hard to imagine that if Joss had let the IDW people in on it from the beginning, they wouldn't have wanted to play ball in order to get the Joss stamp of approval.

[agnes-bean.livejournal.com]

I haven't actually been reading the comics, but I've been keeping up enough to know that I agree with you (plus, I agree in general based on the TV-canon crossovers).

The Connor thing is especially important. Like, okay, ignore the fact that Angel has all these other friends and earthly attachments. That's super lame, and bad characterization, obviously, but I could almost live with it. But he has a fucking son. You just...can't ignore that. Parenthood means a big shift in priorities for most people, and Angel is definitely one of them. Does he mention that he has a child at ALL in the comics? Even if not by name? If not...yeah. If it is impossible to work the plot you want with the characters you have, you need to either come up with new characters, or a new plot.

This was my biggest problem with Angel's appearance in S7, too (since yo mentioned it...) If it had just been Cordy's coma Angel was dealing with when he showed up, I could have bought it better. Clearly, that scene was the writers trying to remind us that Buffy and Angel have this epic doomed love. Which, yeah, I'm not a huge fan of, but if Buffy can leave that scene and go back to her relationship with Spike, I would be fine thinking Angel could leave it and go back to morning Cordy. I do think part of Buffy and Angel will always love each other/love the relationship they had, so in a Connor-free AU, I could theoretically get behind that scene as a general concept, even if the tone was annoying for me.

But as it is...no. Angel's love life should NOT have been the foremost thing on his mind. As you say, if he'd shown up all depressed, and acted jealous more out of force of habit than anything else, that I could have bought. But, I'm sorry. He just gave up his son. There is no way that he cares as much about is potential future with Buffy as he seemed to, at least not at that moment. I can't believe he'd have the mental energy. I can try to fanwank it as an emotional defensive mechanism, but that doesn't sit well with me at all, given that Angel is normally broody mcbroody face.

In conclusion, word. Yes, these shows were in the same verse, but it doesn't mean you can cross them over willy-nilly, without respect for what happened to the characters in-between crossovers. It's insulting to the fans (I mean, heck, I think the S7 Angel-Buffy reunion would have been much MORE interesting if it had had an in-character Angel -- and it probably would have made me more inclined to watch Angel sooner, since it would have hinted that there was actual development going on).

(And, hell, it's not like it's impossible to do an okay crossover. I think the Doctor Who/Torchwood crossovers -- both Jack on Doctor Who and Martha on Torchwood -- are decently respectful to the respective characters and their growth. At least they didn't make me go "WTF am I watching, and what happened to the character I knew?").

[xlivvielockex.livejournal.com]

I wish I could contribute more than just nodding my head and going 'word' to everything you said here and in the comments. I always joke that whenever Angel shows up in Buffy's world, he is Angelbot, because any characterization and development he had on his own shows just goes right out the window. It's like he is back to BTVS S3 Angel.

And I'm so with you on the whole WTFery of Willow in Angel S4. I mean, what? WHAT?!

I just still cannot for the life of me understand HOW this writers, being parents themselves, can completely negate Angel's development in regards to Connor. That he would willingly want the world and his own son destroyed. And for what?

[rebcake.livejournal.com]

Yanno, I totally 100% agree with this, and I don't even really care about Angel, the character. However, I thought about my friends, and how we deal with years of separation, and how sometimes there is enough of a bond, that just picking up the phone every so often does the trick. Would it be so hard to have a scene showing Buffy hanging up the phone and saying, "Wow. I thought I had a lot going on." We wouldn't need a ton of exposition, and it would be sort like all those summers, where we don't know specifically what happened, but we can safely assume that the characters do. It's even better, because if we want the backstory, we don't have to write it ourselves, but can just skip over to the DVD collection.

As it stands, we have to assume that nobody knows anything, and it's just stupid.

[stormwreath.livejournal.com]

Sounds to me like the way they're planning on doing season 9 will be much better for this kind of story. Multiple concurrent arcs focussing on different characters rather than one grand linear four-year storyline. You could have Twilight showing up in Buffy's comic being cryptic and creepy, and at the same time have an 'Angel' comic that has much more space to get into his side of the story. You could even show the same scenes from both points of view, with all sorts of dramatic irony.

[fenderlove.livejournal.com]

The title of your post made me LOL, and because that made my day just a little bit brighter, I thank you even if the comic wanksplosion makes me sad.